Tuesday, 4 November 2008

A simple question for South African expats...

If it was announced at the end of this year that violent crime in South Africa halved to 17 murders per 100 000, would you come back ?

Think about it for a moment and answer honestly to yourself.

If your answer is yes , and you're white , then already you've just made an absurd statement. That crime rate is higher than the one white South Africans currently experience. But that's not the point at all, any sane person knows the perception of crime regarding South Africa is totally irrational. The point is : What would it take you to return to South Africa ?

Please...I don't want to hear negative tirades about "It will never happen" etc. I just want to get some kind of idea of what it would take you to pack up and come home. Perhaps it's about violent crime, perhaps it's about your perception that you can't get a job (ridiculous by the way , 4.6 % of white South Africans are unemployed ...less than the unemployment rate in the U.S.A) ? Is it just something you'll never consider while a black government is in place no matter how much crime and the economy have improved since 1994 ?

So let's get a sense of where you guys are coming from.

If you're not yet an expat , but a disgruntled South African , then perhaps you could answer the question to in the sense of what it would take you to stay. If you're like me and a very happy South African perhaps you could answer what it would take you to leave. I'm looking forward to your answers but please be honest. Drop the drama queen tantrums for a moment and let's have an adult conversation.

Peace and love


Anonymous said...

Rooster old man - you gonna have to get with the program here. Not that I am a fan of SAS but their latest breed of contributors are laying down links as references for the statements they make. Far for me to judge which side of the argument is credible or not but I think your "lazy" comment that "you got the stats\info from news24" just, to put it plainly, sucks! Its your blog - why should I trawl the net to see if you're right?
If you are going to make sweeping statements about SA crime/finance/growth etc you gonna have to get links in tracking the actual pages where you get the info - or it just seems that you're "blowing them outta your ass" as a lot of your detractors point out.
Use it\Don't use it - you're call.

Anonymous said...

If it was announced at the end of this year that violent crime in South Africa halved to 17 murders per 100 000, would you come back ?

An emphatic NO.

That is way higher than where I am now.


Anonymous said...

The point is : What would it take you to return to South Africa ?


The Rooster said...

i did not say half the crime was the only option. I asked what it would take to bring you back. I have always said I respect all the saffer expats who left because they honestly felt they had no future here....look...i don't hate you...you did what you thought was best for your family. Most of you are work your asses off doibng crap jobs overseas for no money to afford a quality of life much worse than you had before. And most of you are doing it because you're good blokes who want to do everything to protect those you love and protect. I respect you with all my heart. honestly. You're often misinformed and neurotic but who am I to tell you what to do with your life and your loved ones ? no man....please....you're not my enemy.

It's those who can't answer this question...because their world view is based on pure racism and hate for black people I'm against. They can't answer this quewstion because no amount of improvement except for a white government and black people as slaves again would be good enough for them. To those of you who don't fit this description...Rooster loves you and wished your swift return to South Africa. You're my brothers and this land is as much yours as anyones....it's your home ...and I fight for it while you can't. So give me some love back once in a while.

The Rooster said...

Its your blog - why should I trawl the net to see if you're right?

Don't take my word for it or S.a.S or anyone else for that matter. Follow through and gather your own data but make sure that data is not cherry picked or distorted to follow through a racist agenda. Good objective analyis I am sure will lead you to conclude that which I have proposed.

Look to your left on ym page..there's a link to my "south african myth quick fix page" ..where I link and validate some of my more meat and potatoes claims. I will keep developing it so that eventually it becomes a one stop page for people wanting to have these kinds of arguments to get their data.

Anonymous said...

Well Rooster...what will it take for me to come back?

You say: "Most of you are work your asses off doibng crap jobs overseas for no money to afford a quality of life much worse than you had before."

Maybe you are right, but maybe not. Most of the people who have left are the highly skilled ones...not the ones who clean toilets in London.

I am an engineer. I earn three times as much as I did in SA. My living conditions are ten times better. Better products to buy at shops. Better service when you deal with companies and government institutions...there is just no comparisons.

But you wanted to know what will it take to get me back?

Stop affirmative action. I was not affected by it nor did I leave because of it. I hhate it because it is racism and morally wrong. Same goes for sport quotas and university entrances.

Crime is another one. You are wrong Rooster. We have all been affected by it. The police´s hands are tied and the criminals have more rights than the victims. Criminals get treated at state expense and victims have to pay for themselves. Thats wrong man.

Stop driving farmers off their land just because you can and it is fun. THE GOVERNMENT HAS ENOUGH FERTILE LAND THEY CAN DISH OUT TO THE NEEDY.

Stop killing Farmers before there is a famine in SA.

Stop attacking Afrikaans language and the learning intitutions. I am not Afrikaans, but I can see what is happening and it is wrong.

And dont give me that, "They did it to us so now we do it to them Crap". It is still wrong.

Have a fair government system with proper representation for minorities, not a tyranny of a majority.

Stop taxing hard working productive and law abiding people to death so you can give more money to unproductive lazy and criminal people. It is wrong.

Stop trying to wipe out history with name changes. Yeah, whites might have done some bad things to blacks, but so did blacks to whites. Bloukrans for one springs to mind. But Whites also contributed a hell of a lot to make SA successful. Start acknowledging that and give whites their due.

Instead of making whites feel like criminals, acknowledge their contributions, work together and wipe out this guilt and blame between races. Blacks aren´t little angels you know. Stop fermenting hatred, fear and distrust...coming mostly from the ANC, Cosatu and the SACP. Daily...

Oh ja...lift the ban on perlemoen diving and I will be back tomorrow.

The Rooster said...

Well if you earn three time more than an engineer it doesn't make up for the fact you pay 5-10 times the amount for tyhe same kind of houses ...and5 times the p[rice for booze/eating out....maids/gardeners etc....you need to earn 10 times the ammount in a western county to live neatly as well as you will in S.A.

But hey...it's your life buddy....please...i appluad your right to live where you want. Within the rest of your post you mkake some valid good level headed critique that didnb;'t resort to shouting "baboons ! Uhuru ! ?Genocide ! K@ffirs ! even once....and therefore I'm so much more open to it. But you still did say some silly things...white have no need to feel like criminals. a white person who embraces the black community...I guarantee you will be met with total respect, love and enthusiasm without exception. I think you'll find that when white people aren't being biggoted slavemaster and express a want to mix with their fellow south africans that black south africans will be quit to give them the respect that is due.

Anonymous said...

No Rooster...listen carefully. I said I am an angineer and earn three times more than in SA.

Further...My house (same size) cost me about the same as in SA but has a lot more benifits. Central heating, double glazed windows...and the best of all...no burglar bars. No six foot fence. No Alarm system even. Where I live food is actually cheaper than in SA. And of a much better quality. I can send you some newspaper adds and flyers if you doubt me. I get all the SA wines here and they are similarly priced as in SA. Only in Restuarants are they about double as in SA. Hotels are cheaper here than in SA and Restuarants (food)as well. All of a much better quality. Further...here are no vagrants going through my dustbin when I put it out on a Monday, as in SA. No shacks and mess...and no minibus taxis trying to run you off the road. Satelite TV is cheaper. Phones and Cellphones are cheaper. Fuel is about R15 a liter (Eur12) and about the only thing I can say that is not cheaper or on par with SA, but we have a proper public transport system, buses, trains, trams, etc...and children walk to school or cycle...in safety. So Fuel actually works out cheaper here, because parents do not have to fear their children´s safety and do not have to cart them arround the whole day. In SA I would never let my 8 year old daughter walk 500m to school.

So Rooster. Stop painting SA as this wonderful paradise that it is not. Stop painting Europe as this expensive hell and place of misery. Living in Europe is ten times better than in SA. I can honestly say that without lying one tad. SA use to be like this. In SA I use to know and visit my neighbours as I do here in Europe. SA is not like that anymore. Whenever I go back to visit friends or family, I can see the worries on their faces and the fear in their eyes. Thank God I educated myself and got out in time. SA is not normal. Nobody can or should live like that. I for one won´t move back there, unless the crime is seriously addressed, all racist policies like AA and BEE scrapped and minority rights protected (Such as the right to study and practice your culture in your mother tongue, without being called a racist for doing so). I have tried reconciliation in SA. Really tried to work with others and help and uplift them, but all I encountered was hatred. Hatred being fuelled from the ANC government, telling blacks how evil whites are. So eventually I gave up and left. Why should I tollerate that and accept guilt of something I had no say in? Stuff collective guilt, I say! When blacks maybe stop hating whites and are really interrested in reconciliation, then maybe we can talk. At the moment I don´t think blacks are ready to forgive and forget yet. They see a white skin and they think "Opressor". Their attitude also makes whites more apprehensive and it all spirals downward in a vicious cycle. Everybody loses and nobody gains. Maybe when blacks stop listening to the ANC and SACP propaganda and start to acknowledge the positive things that whites did in SA, then we can talk. Until then I am happy here in Europe. I have no real need to go back to SA, so why should I? Maybe SA also doesn´t have a need for me to come back, because the issues I raised is viewed as racism. So, good luck to them. I wish them only the best. Until then...Include me out of the current SA.

The Rooster said...

Oh bullshit ...who are you trying to fool ? We've all been to europe and know bhow ridiculously crappy and unafordable life is for the middle classes. Pay the same for the same house/wine/food ? Are you on drugs ? You must be making a lot of money because you're out of touch with the average person in your country.

Anonymous said...

Hey Rooster, you dont have to "Oh Bullshit" me. I have no need to lie. Why should I? I am not trying to fool anyone. Europe can be expensive for a tourist if you go to all the tourist joints, just like SA, but for us normal middleclass people who live here, it is actually wonderful. Scandinavia is expensive, I will admit that, but the rest of Europe is fine.

Dont believe me? Why not search for houses in Germany, Belgium or Austria on the internet? Or check out supermarkets...Hey. give me some items and I will go and check prices for you and send it on. Clothes I have noticed are a lot more expensive here in Europe than Edgars or Woolworths in SA, but Quality is much better and the fashions are up to date, not three years behind as in SA. Even Cars are cheaper in Europe than SA. Cars are cheaper in Belgium than in Germany...anyway...believe what you want. Just do some research and you will find after making some sums...Europe beats SA hands down as a place to LIVE.

Now Australia is expensive. been there, done that. I wont urge people to go there. Low class people and stuff in shops are expensive. Salaries are also lower than in Europe.

Europe is also much easier to get into than Australia or NZ. No long online forms that takes you days to complete. Just get a job and come. Easy as that. Work visa is simple to get. Fill in a form, pay the money and away you go. I did it all myself with no agents and shit. The worst part was getting my certificates translated by a sworn translator. That was expensive and took a bit of time. The rest was simple and straight forward. Took me about four months from Job interview to Living here fulltime.

The Rooster said...

I reallt don't know which part of your arse you are pulling this from. Middle classes white europeans live better than middle classed white south africans ? Do you reallt allign yourself with such total rubbish ?

I have lived and travelled in europe extensivelly...and one needs to be elitist to live in the way that a poorish white south african lives. I think if you ask any europe who has been to South Africa they will agree. There are not 20 000 brits moving to S.a every year without a reason.

Sorry mate...you might have a great job...but we in S.a earn piles because of the economy lately....and we live damn well. try do a study of saffers in englanbd....you'll find 90% are miserable and miss home ...and 10% who hit it lucky are happy. I'm sorry man...this is the just a fact.

The Rooster said...

You mentioned Belgium....well if belgium is so cheap tell me when i just popped over to a belgium site and my jaw dropped when I saw 700 Euros plus to RENT a 1 bedroom apartment!!! Jesus...do you know what a nice LARGE HOUSE you can still OWN with a bond payment of 700 Euros in S.A ? Crazy !! When I looked at prices I could not even see a house for under 300 000 Euros (4 million rand !!!!)...just crappy apartments with no yard..NOTHING !!! That on a huge property website with hundreds of results I did not see one home that looked anything even as close to nice as the crappies home any middle classed south african lives in...that for the price you could buy a huge mansion in south africa for. In fact you could buy 8 apartments of similar description. Thanks buddy..you're huge distortion of the facts just inspired a blog post I'll write later today.

As an example look at this decription

545.000 €
270 m² - 2 bed.
1020 Bruxelles 2


7 million rand for a 270 square meter , 2 bedroom home ?

In fact I've just gone back and it's insane how unaffordable these homes are.

Go look here if you don't believe me folks :


But when I look at the UK and Germany it only gets worse. You just can't find the type of houses with gardens and space middle classed south africans live in for anything under a huge fortune. tut tut tut....you can keep that bullshit ! No wonder 20 000 brits move to S.a every year ...far more than saffers that leave to go there.

The Rooster said...

Holy crap ! And they don't earn much more than the average middle classed saffer and get taxed hugely !!! .....why would you people live in these places ? Are you masochists ?

The Rooster said...

That's it...any expats want to come clean. Don't be selfish ! Just because you're suffering abroad don't encourage other south africans to do the same. I know there are plenty of you who are thinking it " This was a bad choice" ...but manage to tolerate it because you convinced yourself you were going to get killed in S.A....admit that much ! Your quality of life has suffered greatly !!

I'd love to do an interview with someone whose willing to be honest and come clean and stop misleading other south africans and leading them into a shitty life.


Message me and we'll do it.